Engaging with AI: A Christian Perspective w/Michael Woodfield

Don't miss this enlightening conversation on integrating faith with technology. Tune in now and explore how you can use AI to enhance your life and business while staying true to your values.

Explore how Christians can thoughtfully engage with AI. Garrett welcomes Michael Woodfield, a pastor and coach, shares insights on balancing technology with faith, the importance of intent, and how AI can be a tool for excellence in business and personal life.

Key Points:

Understanding AI's role in our lives and its potential benefits and pitfalls. The importance of maintaining authenticity and personal voice in content creation. How to use AI and automation to free up time for meaningful interactions. The significance of aligning AI use with Christian values and stewardship.

Connect with Michael:

Visit KingdomCampfires.com for more insights and to connect with Michael Woodfield

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Transcript

0:00

What's up, everybody? Welcome back to another episode of the Faithful Agent podcast. I am honored to have Michael Woodfield with me here today. I was blessed to be a guest on his show, Kingdom Campfires, and he's here today to talk to us about artificial intelligence and how do Christian agents rightly engage and think about AI, which is an important conversation that we have that we need to have and we're going to continue to have. He's a pastor and a coach, and he helps Christian entrepreneurs with AI and automation, the founder of Kingdom Campfires. Michael, thank you so much for being here, brother. Let's just dive right in. And so you've been in that space, you're helping agents in that space, specifically Christian entrepreneurs. How do we rightly think about AI in the biblical context? How do we engage with it? What do we need to be thinking about? And maybe some of the dangers we're going to get into that. But man, just give me your first take. How do we think about AI as Christians? Yeah, yeah. Well, first of all, just thank you for having me on the show. I know there's so many opportunities that we get to speak and this is a good one for me. I appreciate it. um When you start looking at AI, one thing I like to say is um one thing we forget is we've been using AI for years. Obviously, with chat GPT rolling out a couple of years back, it kind of came on the scene as something new. But if you think of your phone, you pick up your phone right now. You use Siri, you go to Google, you're using AI whether you realize it or not before they even implemented their new Google AI in the search engines. We've been using AI for years, so it's not a thing of whether it's good or bad. It's like a brick. I know we've all heard the analogy. You can take a brick and build a house with it, or you can take a brick and chuck it at somebody. and cause injury. So there's this good and bad both that can happen with anything. And I think sometimes we forget that when we're talking about technology. If you're using it properly, it can become a tool that you can leverage to really accelerate things in your life, whether it's in your personal life and everyday life, whether it's something in your home or like right now, if I shout out to my device, I won't call its name because it'll click on and then turn off everything I'm using right here. You And I love it. I can walk into my office and I can just call out the device's name and say Michael's office on and it will take care of everything for me and I'm ready for my day. So I think it's just cool to be able to understand AI. And then once you understand it is like how can I best leverage it? Where do we start then? What does that even mean? What do you mean understand AI? Because I'm with you, the predictive texting and all of those things have already existed with chat GPT. Now it became, oh my gosh, it's everywhere. Like you said, it was. But I think the conversation is everywhere. So what does it even mean? What is understanding AI? Start there. Yeah, think a big thing is just understanding that there's so many things that are moving quickly. mean, when when chat GPT came on the scene, everybody's like, OK, I'm going to type up the best prompt ever, and it's going to give me this information. And then maybe it came out all right. And they're like, oh, that didn't turn out the way I wanted. And then they put another prompt in and it still is not coming out what they want. And they just give up and they walk away and they're like, this is garbage. It don't work. If you understand how it's just like any computer, whatever you put into it is what you're to get out of it. So putting in quality information and then continually refining that information gets us a better outcome. And I think a lot of times because we didn't have either proper training or good information, we step into using tools. um And it can happen with any tool. We're just using AI in this conversation. But we step into using tools and they don't work out the way we wanted. And so we get frustrated. um If you have small kids, you understand, like you give them a new toy and if they don't understand how it works, they don't know how to really get the full function of it. But when you set and demonstrate it to them, they light up, they're pushing all the right buttons, and it's no different with AI. If you understand how to push the right buttons and put the right information in, you'll light up. The whole world changes and things get easier. So that's the thing I love about it is like figuring out how to leverage specific tools. And I have a few, a handful of them. I'd be happy to share that with anybody that asks. Yeah, definitely. you know, from, from my perspective, I use AI a lot and I've, I've learned it to ask first, can AI do this? Right. You know, even with my assistant, like having her ask, can AI do this? Because a lot of times it is better and faster. I mean, it's always faster. Most of the time it's better, uh, than I would be at a, at a specific thing. I think that I find myself Michael and I'd be curious because, know, you especially coming at it from a perspective of both a coach, but also a pastor. I find myself asking is AI number one, if I just become so reliant on am I giving up the ability to think properly, right? And then coupled with that a little bit, right, is it is easy for me to go to, you know, it's the new Google, right? Most people are, not most people, a lot of people are chat GPT, whatever you'd say, as opposed to Googling something. And so if I'm like, man, what is that, you know, scripture verse that I'm trying to figure out, chat GPT will pull it up like that. It's amazing. and it becomes a tool that is super helpful uh... when it comes to understanding the word and and and knowing what difference was or whatever but also i think it's for us as humans in general become so reliant on all this must be true words giving me this information whatever and it can become something that now becomes a crutches pulling us away from the hard work of you know i'll give a super quick example at a buddy of mine who's in the technology space michael and he says We're having a conversation about AI and he says, you know, Garrett, I'm taking my wife away on an anniversary trip this coming weekend. This was a couple of months ago, taking my wife on this, this anniversary trip this coming weekend. And it was, I was amazing. used chat GPT to help me plan this incredible trip. Right. I prompted, I told her, told him about, or told it about her and it gave me this amazing plan and we're going to do that. And he said, but after that was done, he's, he's an elder at his church too. He said, after that was done, I wondered, man, was that the appropriate way? to honor and love my spouse, right? Because I didn't think about her really at all. I just used this computer to make this amazing trip. Now it's going to be amazing, but where do I even fall there, right? I think those kinds of conversations for a Christian who's trying to think rationally and biblically about it, we don't know where to land. We don't know when should I use it, when should I not? Should I always use it? Should I never use it? And what are your thoughts on that space? Yeah, and I think that that's a really good question. think a lot of times it would vary based on the person and the situation. And I don't know if there's a one size fits all. answer for that. in the example you're using there with him, you know, this is his anniversary. This is a special moment, a special time with him and his wife. I think, you know, from a personal touch perspective to me, just for me, doesn't mean for him. But I would I would really put more time maybe into that and then even put more prompts into it. Like these are the things that I know my wife loves. These are these are the areas where I want to really connect with my wife on in this time and in this space and this place we're going and put more effort into it and then it's using it more for ideas than actually giving me a uh kind of choreographed or spelled out schedule and just giving me some ideas and then from there Refining that down and really taking and putting the effort into it now again That's back to the prompts I can put in a short prompt and it'll give me a ton of information Doesn't mean it's actually in tune with where I'm at if I'm looking at maybe I'm refining something for a Weekend message that I'm doing maybe I'm speaking on the platform this weekend and I just want to get a good message So I just put in a quick prompt and it puts me out, know three 45 minutes presentation is what it would call it. It's like here's your sermon and that's so impersonal first of all but second of all you're not relying on Holy Spirit to lead and guide you in that so it's like I would say that's the wrong use. For me, I would say that's the wrong use of AI. But if you're putting the effort into it and putting the refining features into it that we as humans know that we can do when we're creating content and then just leveraging it for more concepts, more ideas, and even just... Maybe that's something I haven't thought of. that's something he would have not thought of to take his wife on this specific thing in that trip. Wouldn't have considered it. But it's cool that AI can give us that. But if we don't put any thought into it, then we wind up just kind of blindly falling into different things. And then we're no longer even in control of our own lives. Right. mean, is it looking at it, Michael, as this is a really, really smart assistant, right? That I need to converse with and help it help me and it understand what I'm trying to accomplish as opposed to, like you said, I do think it's easy. I've fallen prey to this for say I need whatever. And it's, there's no thought behind it. Just like, okay, great. I'll just take whatever you have because I'm moving too fast and I just need something and you know, appropriate, maybe sometimes inappropriate other times. I don't know. But you know, are we looking at it as, look, you've got now for 20 bucks a month, right? For chat, GPT plus or whatever. Uh, you've got this really, really smart assistant and you needed to use that assistant to help you figure out X, Y, and Z, but it's not the leader of this, uh, your business. It's not the leader in your family. It's none of those things. The Lord still needs to be the one, you know, that you submit to. And the Lord is the only one that contains and has wisdom. Uh, this machine can spit back out information. It's good at it. Well, true. That's very true, right? Doesn't even mean it's accurate. is that like when we if we could I think a reason why agents and people in general are either using all using it without any kind of uh thoughtfulness about it quite honestly, or they're not using it at all is because they're not looking at it in the right perspective to say what is this? It's a tool but But it feels like more than that. mean, I don't know, Michael, what do you think? It just feels like it's more than just a CRM or a Google. It feels bigger than that. yeah, and I think it starts with education. The challenge we're at is we're so new in this new revolution of AI. We're so new into it that a lot and it's moving so quickly with new concepts and new ideas and new iterations being rolled out continually that we can get lost in all of it. And so if you don't have like a baseline of education there of understanding like, first of all, what are the use cases? What are the methods that you can accomplish things? You if you don't have all these this clear structure or baseline. and then you just start using it, you're going to wind up in a ditch somewhere. it's my... the thing I see happening a lot is people will start utilizing it incorrectly. It'll put out information, they get in a hurry and then they don't double check it to see if it's actually accurate and push it out to a client or a friend or whatever and then realize that, oh, I'm sorry, that was not even a good representation of who I am or what I am. So there's a lot of use cases. that it would work really well, and I love your analogy there of an assistant. um I have virtual assistants that I work with um around the world, and in that, I would never just blindly trust them with everything in my business, because it's my business. They don't own it, they don't have that responsibility. So as a responsibility, as a steward of what I have, I have to take ownership and then in that, it's like if you look at this process of discipleship that we have in our faith, it's the same thing in business. It's the process of growth and strategizing, but it's actually being discipled or understanding or following a way in how to leverage these new tools. And I think if we position that correctly and we get the right information from either a trusted source or a good resource, then we can stand to be leveraging it properly. Yeah, that's good. mean even though so so shifting a little a bit but You know, I have questions for agents in the way we use it. So for example It's often used as content creation, right? Which a lot of people use it not just agents or a real estate agent will use it to write their listing remarks for a house or whatever it is and you know, I don't know inherently that seems like not a problem, but do we need to be asking deeper questions, right? So for example If I go to chat GPT and I just give it a prompt, right? The basic chat GPT, not where, like for example, for my book, I have a GPT built that just pulls from that manuscript, which I wrote without chat GPT. And so it's my word. So whatever it gives me, it's pulling from what I already said. I feel like that's maybe a little bit different, but if I just go to a basic prompt, right? A new chat with chat GPT, and I just say, I need some content. Here it is. And I copy and paste and I put it out there. and I put it out there as my own, do we need to be asking deeper questions and saying, that plagiarism? Am I lying? As a believer, am I held to a higher standard? Is it okay that I just, I mean, effectively take somebody else's language and use it as my own? What do you think? And the challenge in that you just describe the two different ways that you can create the content. If you're using a knowledge base that's that's resourcing your language, your words, how there's a there's a consistency in our language, right? There's things that you talk about consistently, words that you use consistently that anybody that knows you would recognize like, yeah, that's that's definitely Garrett. But then there's words that you'd never use. And so if you use the prompt without the knowledge base, without that resource that you just described where it's captured how you talk about these subjects, then it's going to keep putting out information that can look really good, but no one's going to recognize it as your voice. And people are going to see that and they may never say anything, but they're going to see that and think, wow, did he create that with AI? Did he really take any time at all to read this? And so people, see this, are getting called out more and more and it's sad but it's kind of funny too because it's like, wow, if you just had taken a moment to create a knowledge base. Like for me, love, I speak regularly on the weekend in my church locally and then I do a lot of training online. So I love to take that information and refine it as a knowledge base to say this is the language that I use consistently because I can't be any different. on the weekend than I am in my everyday life. If it's not, then there's an inconsistency there and people will pick that apart. So I create a consistency in all my language so that when I'm sharing something, whether it's something that was created by leveraging AI or if it's something that I just set and spent hours and hours of study, however that came about, there's a consistency in all of it. So I think that's important even as agents if you're looking at creating something that you're creating a knowledge base to pull from that's using your language, your voice, so that it comes across as authentic. Is it so if we go to, you know, backtrack to I post or excuse me, I asked for content. take word for word and I post it. Right. Cause I'm with you. mean, create your own knowledge base and you can look up how to do that. Michael can show you, I'm sure. Uh, right. Which I agree with. think that's, that's absolutely the way to do it. And for you and I, we create content, right? We've got podcasts, you're working on a book. I've got a book that, you know, we're fortunate that we have a lot of content that's written in our own voice. So that's not that difficult. for somebody else, maybe that is challenging for somebody else to have all of that content that they can actually use as a filter. So they go to give me a caption to post and they just post it again. I mean, is that inappropriate? really think there's like as Christians, we got to think deeper about this. Is that inappropriate without saying, you know, written by chat, GPT or, you know, whatever, like giving some sort of Credence to who actually wrote it, you know, I don't know I I'm not trying to make a rule where there isn't one because scripture doesn't talk about that But I don't know. What are your feelings on that? I think it can come across as harsh to say it's inappropriate. I wouldn't judge someone based on that, just for me. But at the same time, I think it comes across as inauthentic or unauthentic. I don't know what the right word is. It's not authentic. So again, if I'm not using, if I'm not leveraging my own voice in the content that I'm creating, then who's talking? And if people are listening to that and connecting with that, who are they listening to and connecting with? So if I want to create, I believe if you look at the heart of the kingdom, everything in the kingdom is about a relationship. It starts and ends with relationship. And if we can't create, if we can't be authentic in what we're putting out to the world and the content that we're creating, then I would have to just question like, who are they connecting with? Who do I want them to connect with? Do I want to connect with me? Do I want them to connect with God? Do I want them to connect with AI or some hollow voice? So I think that's the, to me, that would be the more deciding factor on whether to just put content out there where you're leveraging AI is like, what's your intent and goal? And really looking at, again, my take on it, the heart of the kingdom is relationships. So I'm gonna go that route. I love that as a question. I was even actually thinking through this morning, Michael, now not in reference to AI in particular, but thinking through this morning, you know, I've tried to, especially with the book coming out, be more consistent in creating content on social and being better about those things. And, you know, just, I don't know if it was full on conviction, you know, honestly, but just kind of thinking through, asking myself the question, man, what's the, what is the end game? Because I would, I would, say out loud that the end game is, of course I wanted to bring glory to the father. want, you know, people to be saved. Like the reason that I'm here, I'm a missionary. You know, the gospel is the end game for everything. But, but if I was really honest, I was trying to be with myself was, know, Karen, I think the end game is you're just trying to get influence of people by your book, you know? And what's difficult is inherently that's not bad. not that, you know, someone buying your book is a bad thing. But it's what's the end game, right? Who am I seeking to bring glory to? Is it me or is it the Lord? And if it's me, I'm going to judge it by, well, did I sell thousands and thousands of books then? Then and only then do I feel like I did a good job honoring the Lord. is it, however I present myself, whatever my content is about, right? Whenever that one person buys the book and they want to have a conversation with me, is it about me and the things that I've done? Which, you again, I can teach through with life experiences are good things. But does it ultimately fall down to what I really want you to know is that Jesus paid the penalty for your sin, right? Rose again from the dead. Is that what I want you to know? Or do I really want you to know who I am and that I have a book? That's difficult. And so I love that question of the intent in using AI. Why am I using this? Is it because I just want to be better, smarter, faster? Or is it because I actually think it's going to help me be more excellent at what the Lord has called me to do, which is going to bring praise and glory to His name, which is going to hopefully open the door to gospel conversations. Right. It has led us to this. The end game is, and I want to shift to automation because you talk about that too, but I feel like it shifted us to the end game is just efficiency. How fast can you do it? uh And again, there's no end game to that at all. Nobody's going to care how fast you did things when you're dead. Right? That doesn't matter. The Lord doesn't care how fast you did things. He cares about your heart posture before him. Right? So this idea of automation, why, let's start here. Why does that matter? What does it even need to be automated and why does that matter? Yeah, I think I would start with a question of what are we stewarding? If you look at what you can accomplish with AI and automation, we have a finite amount of time. There's only 24 hours in a day. We all have the same amount of time. I've heard people say like, time's your most valuable resource. And actually, that's not true, because you can actually run out of energy before you run out of time. So energy is your most valuable resource. Like how do I spend my time actually dictates like where my energy is going. So if I'm looking at like being a good steward of what resources God has given me and I think of AI and automations as one of the tools in my tool belt, I have to look at like, okay, if I'm freeing up time in some specific areas, not all areas, but I'm freeing up time in some specific specific areas which frees up my energy, which frees up my mind to be able to focus on other things, then what am I doing with my time and what am I really, where am I pushing my energy to? Jesus said, my yoke is easy and my burden is light. So I think we're in a world where things can feel really heavy because there's so many things pulling for our attention. There's so many things that are um absorbing our time and energy and we can feel like this pressure the world has to be successful, to get our book out there, you know, whatever it is that we're trying to focus on right now in this season. And we can wind up spending all of our energy on the wrong things, talking, even sometimes talking to the wrong people. But when we use things like AI and and automations to refine our voice, to actually tune in so so we can get people to tune in to us not. not just like this white noise that you can see, especially if you scroll on social media for a few minutes, but when they can hear our voice, our true voice, then they can identify, is this for me? And when they start raising their hands saying, is this for me? There's certain specific people that you've been given to reach here. There's specific people that I would never talk to. And just as it is for me, there's people that I'll talk to this week, this month, the rest of this year that you'll never know. But they're identifying our voice, right? They're identifying. If you're looking at the book that you're releasing, they're going to be identifying your voice in there. So now it's your if you're looking at how can I be a good steward of my time and energy? Then you want to make sure that you're talking to that best audience that's going to raise their hand and say, I identify with what Garrett's saying. And not everyone's going to raise their hand. It's just a fact. We've each been given a sphere of influence and a metron, right? We've got this measure of influence that we've been given. And if we're looking at like, how can I be best utilized in my energy, well, we have to look at how we can leverage AI and automations to be the best we can. It's good. It's a good way to look at it, right? It's the, you know, you've asked good questions, but it's, the question of, for example, in the real estate world, if, you know, it's going to take me whatever an hour to write these listing remarks when a, could do it in five seconds and I could go spend that hour with a person, right. And caring for that person, because I know that's what the Lord's called me to do in my work and this specific sphere that I have, like you said, then I'm going to go do that. That's a good, right, godly thing, I think. uh Right? If it's the, I think that's maybe the appropriate way to think about it. I think that the temptation for me, for most of us, I imagine is I'm going to use that to write those listing remarks in five seconds. and then create a content in five seconds and then make a new video with the a i have a tarred five seconds and do this and five and i'm going to be so efficient and everything all the time always i can plan a vacation for my wife and i right i can uh... meal plan i can uh... figure out all of these pieces of all at once and i'm gonna be so hyper effective that that i'm gonna be the superhuman right i'm gonna accomplish all of this stuff when uh... you know i think that's the temptation right is now that we've got this hyperactive uh... incredible tool at our fingertips it becomes maybe that we start to feel even less and less valuable and important and and and worth less because we're not moving as quickly as everyone says that we should be now and you're taking time when i tell people that i take time to think every week like what is that for you know i read the prompt chat gbt and have a conversation i like i did that to you know but but like cuz i don't want to lose that part i you know there's a difference between like you mentioned earlier listening to what this smart computer says in listening to what the lord says right because the the linear conclusion of chat gpt to say you'd operate whatever you need up for your family moved to egypt to become a missionary that doesn't exist but in the world of falling jesus it doesn't mean that what he doesn't do or that what he does is that linear a lot of times it is that And the world of following Jesus and the world of listening to what the Holy Spirit's trying to prompt us, right? He's prompting us is maybe to say, hey, you need to uproot your family and move to Egypt and go be a missionary. And it's our responsibility to say, yes, Lord, I'm here. I'm yours. I'm going to follow what it is that you have for me. So, you know, this bigger, broader context of it's here as Christians, we can't run away from society. We have to be willing and able to engage it, right? Which is one of the things I appreciate what you're doing. We have to try to rightly understand it. How can I use this for the glory of God? I can't ignore it because it's here and a lot of people are going to use it. So how do I do this to the glory of the Father? And then a point that you started hitting on, but I'm convinced that if we're going to do anything that we believe is worth doing, we need to do it with excellence. That's how we honor the Lord. And I'm guilty of not doing that, right? uh But if you're going to engage in AI, do it with excellence. And if you can't, maybe don't or wait till a time that you can figure it out, right? But we often run scared. And so we're trying to play catch up all the time. It's like, oh man, I got to get into this chatty-pity thing or social media. I got to start posting on social media. We kind of run from behind. We run scared and we kind of let the, what the culture is doing dictate what we should be doing as opposed to just stop for a second, think biblically about it and say, All right, I believe that maybe I should be using AI. I need to go talk to someone like a Michael and say, how do I do this? Well, right. What am I stewarding and how does this help me steward it as opposed to how do I steward this? But now I have time to also steward that in this and that, and none of those things are what the Lord gave you. They're outside of this fear that you're supposed to be in. Right. So I just, I love the conversation. I love the questions of your intent, your stewardship. those pieces matter as we try to think about this from a biblical worldview you know i i i'm gonna rap us here sick but from a from a biblical world view michael i mean are there is scriptures that we should be meditating on that would even you know come close to talking about a i or how we think about this from the most biblical world view or they need that they become to mind Yeah, I think the the two that I would say one is I mentioned it a minute ago Jesus said my yoke is easy and my burden is light so if we're leaning in to something and we feel like it's overwhelming us then I would I would um Just challenge like is that a yoke that Jesus has put on you? He's invited you into. And the other one is seek first the kingdom of God. So everything we're looking at, you're talking about this thing of where we're spending our time and this linear thing. If you look at Cronos time versus Kairos time, if we get so caught up in Cronos, the time on our clock, the month and day of the year, and we miss the opportune time, that Kairos moment, those opportune moments where the Lord's trying to speak to us. to tell us to uproot our family and move across the country or around the world. We can totally miss what God's doing in the moment. So seeking first the Kingdom of God will keep you on that road and then measuring what we're bringing into our life. Is this a yoke that Jesus is asking me to do? Is this something Jesus is inviting me into? Yeah, it's good. I love the Matthew 6, right? Seek first the kingdom of God, because there's no AI in that, right? That's not a computer-generated or computer-supported activity. It's you before the Lord on your knees in the Word, right? Submission to the Father and what that looks like. And, I know in my own life, uh when I am actively submitting well to the Lord and prayerful about what I'm doing and in His Word, then... AI doesn't overwhelm me as much because I don't feel like, you know, it's not that it's not helpful. It's just that my confidence is in the Lord, not in artificial intelligence. When I'm not actively asking the Lord to just guide and direct my steps, it can become burdensome, right? Just say like, man, I got to get efficient. I got to do this. I got to do that. look at this new tool. I got to do all these things. So I think at the end of the day, it is this wisdom of how do we seek first? the kingdom i love the question to of is this burdensome is this a light yoke or is this a heavy yoke and if so maybe where did it come from you know what is a self-imposed is it from somewhere else or is it actually from the Lord so having those kinds of conversations brother if they want to continue those kinds of conversations with you how would they go about doing that Yeah, you can connect with me on social media. pretty easy to find Michael Woodfield. But the best way is go to Kingdom Campfires dot com. That's my website. It's podcast on there. The link to our podcast, our YouTube channel, ways to connect. You can be a guest on my podcast as you have been in the past. I mean, you can also look at how to join our community. We have an online space for Christian entrepreneurs. that I'm moving away from Facebook groups and all those type things, the different communities and have a nice Christian branded platform with a mobile app and everything. So that's what I'm working on growing that. So that's the best way to connect. Love it brother man. KingdomCampfires.com agents that will be in the show notes to make sure you go check that out. Michael, thank you so much for coming on brother for your sharing your wisdom, your heart behind this. And I think this is just a topic that we have to continue to talk about it, not be afraid to dive into as we try to understand how do we think about AI biblically? How do we utilize it well in our business that ultimately brings honor and glory to the father. So man brother, just so glad that you came on. uh Agents, we love you and I will see you next week.